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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello Ascent Family, I've finally had the chance to put my Crossclimate2 tires to the test. Winter conditions were a long time coming here in Indiana, but it's here with a vengeance now. Over the past few weeks, we've had days with very icy roads and very cold conditions. The tires worked extremely well and even around turns and quick starts and stops, there has been very little skidding and sliding.

Over the past week, we've had snowfall in the 4-6 in. range, and the cross climates churn right through it. I'm sure the deep channels help move slush and snow away because the Ascent feels very sure-footed in these conditions in both highway and secondary road speeds. Of course, even the famous Subaru all-wheel drive coupled with these tires is a driving match made in heaven, but even so, there is no substitute for remembering safe following distance and situational awareness while driving in Winter conditions. I can now highly recommend the Michelin Crossclimate2 tires without reservation.
God bless and safe driving from Indy. Howard
 

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How many miles do you have on them and are you pleased with their wear rates so far? What is the treadwear warranty on these? Is it 60k?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
How many miles do you have on them and are you pleased with their wear rates so far? What is the treadwear warranty on these? Is it 60k?
Hello, I switched out my Falkens and have about 7,000 on these so far. These seem to wear evenly so far and these are rated for 60K as you mentioned. FYI, Costco had a good deal on these, as they have a Michelin sale and instal discount quarterly, I believe.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
How do the CC2s compare with other winter and/or All-Weather tires you've had in the past?
I've never had dedicated winter tires, but I can tell you compared to even the best all seasons I've had over the years, these outperform them all. These have the 3 mountain peak/snowflake distinction, meaning they are permissible when certain municipalities and states require snow tires and/or chains during severe conditions. I'm in Indy, not the UP of Michigan, so to say I've driven these in severe conditions would be a stretch, but I think 6 in. of snow and slush makes the case for them. Hope that helps.
 

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'Glad you finally got to put them to the test. Believe it or not, it's the siping (small channels) that contribute to the great grip in snow while the wider channels handle the wetter stuff. That tire has a good combination of both.
 
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Glad to hear you have had a good experience with the CrossClimates! I’ll be getting a set for my SAAB winter wheels this spring and will likely get these as replacement for the OEM tires on the Ascent when the time comes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
'Glad you finally got to put them to the test. Believe it or not, it's the siping (small channels) that contribute to the great grip in snow while the wider channels handle the wetter stuff. That tire has a good combination of both.
'Glad you finally got to put them to the test. Believe it or not, it's the siping (small channels) that contribute to the great grip in snow while the wider channels handle the wetter stuff. That tire has a good combination of both.
Thanks for that, Jim. Exactly, there are little sipes all over these tires.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Glad to hear you have had a good experience with the CrossClimates! I’ll be getting a set for my SAAB winter wheels this spring and will likely get these as a replacement for the OEM tires on the Ascent when the time comes.
I think you will be very happy with them. I'm not one for spending $975.00 on tires, but I've had them on rural roads in N. Michigan with dirt, steep inclines, etc and now in Winter conditions. They are very sure-footed and give an added layer of protection along with Subaru's all-wheel drive it's famous for.
 

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I've never had dedicated winter tires, but I can tell you compared to even the best all seasons I've had over the years, these outperform them all..... I'm in Indy, not the UP of Michigan, so to say I've driven these in severe conditions would be a stretch, but I think 6 in. of snow and slush makes the case for them. Hope that helps.
Thank you for the additional details. :)

It always helps to get an idea of the pertinent background of the driver rating/reviewing the tires. (y)

I'm somewhat of an old-hat where it comes to winter tires - a search using my screen-name on this Forum as well as other Subaru hobbyist Forums will show you what I mean. 😅 :p In spite of the fact that I'm continuing to track winter tire performance, as of the last couple of years, I've felt like I've been saying (er...typing?) until I'm blue in the face (fingers/hands/arms?) and yet people are still somewhat reluctant to come around to what the last decade to decade-and-a-half's worth of testing and objective data have come to show (i.e. How much of a difference will winter tires make on cold... ), so I've kinda just given up. :)

It's honestly great to see that All-Weather tires are gaining more traction (no pun intended) here in the States. There are few stateside enthusiast - like @pro10is , for example - who seem to be willing to put forth the effort it takes to truly parse out what each tire's true performance compromises are. In my humble opinion, I think that the benefits under true wintry conditions that come from the use of true winter tires needs to be much better balanced by highlighting the compromises that these tires have when they are used outside of those situations. Sadly, this nuance is virtually impossible to convey via YouTube reviews and the like. ;) Truthfuly, All-Weathers should prove to be an excellent compromise for many drivers, and I really hope that as more drivers purchase this sub-type of tire, it'll drive these tires to be better with each subsequent evolution.
 

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Hello, I switched out my Falkens and have about 7,000 on these so far. These seem to wear evenly so far and these are rated for 60K as you mentioned. FYI, Costco had a good deal on these, as they have a Michelin sale and instal discount quarterly, I believe.
Have you rotated them yet? Did you just do front to rear or did you cross rotate as Subaru states in the manual.
 

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Hello Ascent Family, I've finally had the chance to put my Crossclimate2 tires to the test. Winter conditions were a long time coming here in Indiana, but it's here with a vengeance now. Over the past few weeks, we've had days with very icy roads and very cold conditions. The tires worked extremely well and even around turns and quick starts and stops, there has been very little skidding and sliding.

Over the past week, we've had snowfall in the 4-6 in. range, and the cross climates churn right through it. I'm sure the deep channels help move slush and snow away because the Ascent feels very sure-footed in these conditions in both highway and secondary road speeds. Of course, even the famous Subaru all-wheel drive coupled with these tires is a driving match made in heaven, but even so, there is no substitute for remembering safe following distance and situational awareness while driving in Winter conditions. I can now highly recommend the Michelin Crossclimate2 tires without reservation.
God bless and safe driving from Indy. Howard
I've been trying to convince people here to buy the CrossClimates for some time now, but I've been getting a lot of pushback. It's really great to see someone with a positive experience post here.

My son has them on his Forester. He's an avid skier and a ski instructor. He heads up to the mountains with them several days a week all winter. He loves them and says they're as good or better than the winter tires they replaced because they're so good on so many surfaces and conditions, not just on snow. He runs them year-round.

I can't wait until my current set of tires wears out enough to replace them with CrossClimates. I may just change them even before they wear out.
 

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Have you rotated them yet? Did you just do front to rear or did you cross rotate as Subaru states in the manual.
Here we go again. There is never a need to rotate them in a cross pattern according to Michelin. The Subaru manual suggests a cross pattern because that, in general, is simply the optimal rotation pattern, but not the only one. You cannot do this with directional tires unless you dismount them and you can never run directional tires in the opposite direction.

Subaru is not the end-all authority when it comes to tires. The tire manufacturer's recommendations superseded the owner's manual for directional tires. This is a non-issue. Directional tires are nothing new, they've been around for decades and can offer significant performance gains over non-directional tires which are constrained to working in both directions. These performance gains can far exceed any minor advantages offered by cross rotations.

Front to back rotation is the next best rotation pattern and will work perfectly well for the full tread life warranty of these tires. Some owner manuals suggest only front to back rotations because they do not know if the owner will be running directional tires or not.
 

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I can be totally off on this, but I thought ALL radial tires could only be rotated front to back.
 

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I've been trying to convince people here to buy the CrossClimates for some time now, but I've been getting a lot of pushback. It's really great to see someone with a positive experience post here.

My son has them on his Forester. He's an avid skier and a ski instructor. He heads up to the mountains with them several days a week all winter. He loves them and says they're as good or better than the winter tires they replaced because they're so good on so many surfaces and conditions, not just on snow. He runs them year-round.

I can't wait until my current set of tires wears out enough to replace them with CrossClimates. I may just change them even before they wear out.
I was going to put Falken WildPeak A/Ts on my Outback once my stock ones were shot. Any thoughts between the WildPeaks and the CC2’s? The Peaks are around 125-150 per.
 

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That's a great quesiton -

Overall, "A/T" - All-Terrain - tires fulfill a different function versus All-Weather tires like the CrossClimate.

All-Terrain tires are designed to offer enhanced traction off-road, while All-Weather tires are designed for paved-road.

Even though one may look at the treadblocks and other features of the tires and assume similarities, the consumer needs to understand that the tires' actual capabilities can be drastically different.

All-Terrain tires, as a part of their enhancements off-road, are designed with tread-blocks that shed (i.e. "self clear") dirt, mud, and sand.

While one would imagine that's what we would want in a winter tire, that's actually polar (sorry, bad pun! 😅 ) opposite from what's desired in wintry conditions. If closer attention is paid to the tread of winter tires and their characteristic "sipes" (modern sipes are often "3-dimensional" in-nature, designed to offer even more "bite" as the tire carcass flexes under load), it can be seen that these tread elements actually retain frozen precipitation in their voids, allowing for a "snowballing" effect to take place that helps with traction under those specific circumstances (on the other hand, mud packed sipes, for example, will be hard pressed to offer traction benefits such conditions).

Additionally, the drastic differences in compounding that help each the A/T as well as All-Weather tire perform towards their respective goals may not extend to conditions that exceed those scenarios. For example, even though an A/T tire may fair reasonably well in terms of slushplane resistance (simply due to its larger void ratio) and straight-line forward acceleration in fresh powder or even packed snow (again thanks to the same), their compounding will be far from optimized for grip as roadway temperatures dip towards freezing.

This is why in colder, snowier areas, you'll often see drivers in jacked-up monster-ish trucks with knobby off-road tires who are able to haul-ass on the straights end up being easily passed by drivers in low-slung Subaru WRX/STIs on winter tires, when they have to take a turn at an intersection. ;)

This said, the Falken WildPeak A/T does carry the Severe Service rating, so this would imply that this particular tire should be more geared towards winter-weather use.

However, one should remember that this in and of itself is a variable benchmark (USTMA/RAC >110% of reference - and even this, remember, only measures the tires acceleration on "medium-packed snow," neither braking nor turning on snow, nor ice traction, are tested). This is why you'll find most authorities suggesting that 3PMSF-bearing "All-Season" (note that this is -NOT- the same as "All-Weather" tires, although the latter is in many ways simply an intermediate in the continuum that exists between the former and "winter" tires) and A/T tires cannot match the traction of dedicated winter tires, over the wide range of typical winter weather conditions, and that neither should be a replacement for dedicated winter tires, when such is actually needed.

In your case, @pilot1226, I'd let what you do outside of wintry conditions drive your purchase decision. If you often go camping and need light off-roading capabilities, for example, I'd go with the Falkens - or, if instead your driving is more interstate hops for day-trips where paved roads are the norm, a good All-Weather tire may be a better choice.


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ETA -


^ That post by @Eroi50 demonstrates well what I'd written above. However, one caveat needs to be noted in that different vehicles will often show differences in tire performance - either objectively or subjectively. This is why in the Scandinavian and Russian winter tire testing that Stateside enthusiasts often take as Gold Standards, the vehicle(s) used and the tire size(s) fitted are so painstakingly detailed (much of which dates back to about 15 years ago, actually, when a Russian test showed how these variables can significantly skew testing).
 

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Overall, "A/T" - All-Terrain - tires fulfill a different function versus All-Weather tires like the CrossClimate.

All-Terrain tires are designed to offer enhanced traction off-road, while All-Weather tires are designed for paved-road.

Even though one may look at the treadblocks and other features of the tires and assume similarities, the consumer needs to understand that the tires' actual capabilities can be drastically different.

All-Terrain tires, as a part of their enhancements off-road, are designed with tread-blocks that shed (i.e. "self clear") dirt, mud, and sand.
Real world example...

I run BF Goodrich All Terrain T/A KO2 Light Truck Tires. They are M+S rated, and 3PMSF rated, and, BF Goodrich brags about how good they are in the snow.
  • They're pretty bad when cold, but, even in frigid below zero weather, warm up really quickly.
  • They will claw through almost anything (for instance, during Sunday's snow storm, I drove through a hundred miles of unplowed dirt and mud forest roads - the tires clawed their way up and down every hill I threw at them).
  • They grip when starting to move, better than many other tires I've driven on.
  • They are sloppy on turns on snow covered roads.
  • They are bad at stopping on ice, or light snow on top of packed snow. The Ascent's traction control makes it easy to keep the car under control, but that does nothing for the increased stopping distance.
  • They slide really easily if you apply too much power when turning (great for fun in snow, bad for driving).
Overall, I've got no problems with them, even in blizzards (but, I spend my free time and well over 15,000 miles learning how my Ascent will react on snow, ice, mud and sand - AND I don't drive in snow every day), but, they're not true winter tires, and, the weight of the Ascent, coupled with what they're really designed for, doesn't make them a good choice as a daily in the mountains of Vermont, or for those who live in Watertown and get lake effect snow every day during the winter.

Interestingly, I've driven all terrains that were FAR better in snow, and in the cold, such as the Yokohama Geolandar A/T-S (which ironically wasn't 3PMSF rated), and there are other all terrains that claim excellent winter, ice and snow performance - but, keep in mind, that's compared to other tires in their class (all terrains). Falken claims their AT Trail and AT3W easily beats the KO2's (and weigh a lot less). Those may be a better choice as a daily driver in the snow than my current BFGs, but that doesn't make them better than a true winter tire, much less better than a true snow tire (no all terrain I've seen will come close to a true snow tire).
 

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Thanks for your reply. From what I read the WildPeaks are solid in winter as well. I can’t find a head to head on tire rack yet. I’ll see what I can dig up, but I was under the impression that AT would be better than an all season in snow.
 

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Mine are definitely better than any all seasons that I owned, but not all AT's perform well in winter, or earn a 3PMSF rating.
 
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