[Titanrx8]

I was in the used car business right out of high school. We had a saying, "the money is made when we buy the car". Translation is "buy for under the market". At many new car dealerships, the used car business has it's own balance sheet and actually "buy" cars from the new car trade-ins. If the trades were valued too high, they'll tell the new car side of the business to send the car to auction rather than eat a loss on the used car side. Unless the dealer has back-end money to make them whole, they'll never take a deal that puts them upside down.

 

[Packard8]

I was in the used car business right out of high school. We had a saying, "the money is made when we buy the car". Translation is "buy for under the market". At many new car dealerships, the used car business has it's own balance sheet and actually "buy" cars from the new car trade-ins. If the trades were valued too high, they'll tell the new car side of the business to send the car to auction rather than eat a loss on the used car side. Unless the dealer has back-end money to make them whole, they'll never take a deal that puts them upside down.

I'm thinking of selling my 2017 Sonata Sport Turbo. 46K miles, pristine condition, new tires, freshly detailed. The Subaru dealer offered a $12K trade-in, Carvana offered $19K cash.

I understand that the Subaru dealer is not a philanthropic organization, but neither is Carvana.

 

[cindyascent]

Totally agree with packard8. That’s why I’m like happens good, doesn’t, so what? I don’t need a car, I have a 2019touring. Just trying to take advantage of cars resale to get a new one now instead of down the road. But putting it into perspective, I spoke to one dealer- one I did not purchase a car from, and I’m like 2 k off from “fantasyland”. That’s not 2% off mark, it’s much better.
here is the breakdown: Used want 37600, got 34500.00 with tax advantage it’s equivalent to 37561.88.
car want $42988 got after removing some dealer added stuff I will not need from the sticker example that was used ( bumper cover and thrown in stuff like that) $xx,xxx ( just follow don’t want to give up price).That’s $1435 difference, add in the “doc” fee which is car price to me 400 and we are a big $1835 off. That’s not bad. If I “ needed” a 2022 Subaru ascent, then I would have bought it already at this price.

My point is it’s not that dire. If you look at it as ok a dealer wants to sell a car he doesn’t have to sell at msrp or above- well yes they are “used car salesmen”. Like hearing about these crazy $5000 over msrp. Also remember it’s our tax dollars given to them that allow this egregious behavior.

DONT READ THIS PART:
so I’m looking and it’s not that bad. In fact,I started thinking about this when I recently received one of those dealer mailers stating that they want my car At the guaranteed trade in price. Yes, at Subaru prices it came out to give them 20k, my 2019 touring and get a 2021 touring- a one year old car. That’s when I realized that they were paying the “old” prices, not market prices. Just reselling my, car the dealer will net $4k to $5k. Doing nothing to it - I brought it to them. I’m not crying for any car dealers, just trying to do the best I can which is what everyone wants to do, but they are too afraid to try. There is no chip shortage! No logistics shortage! Look at the Amazon articles. They bought planes, cargo ships, and containers. The companies want to create the appearance of a shortage while they pocket your tax dollars and get the government to pay for their “ problem”. The government is giving $20 BILLION to the chip industry to build plants here. So the real story might be they got so much cash from the government that they can tell their customers to go you know where unless you buy the bs and pay the new “tax”windfall to them!

 

[Packard8]

Totally agree with packard8. That’s why I’m like happens good, doesn’t, so what? I don’t need a car, I have a 2019touring. Just trying to take advantage of cars resale to get a new one now instead of down the road. But putting it into perspective, I spoke to one dealer- one I did not purchase a car from, and I’m like 2 k off from “fantasyland”. That’s not 2% off mark, it’s much better.
here is the breakdown: Used want 37600, got 34500.00 with tax advantage it’s equivalent to 37561.88.
car want $42988 got after removing some dealer added stuff I will not need from the sticker example that was used ( bumper cover and thrown in stuff like that) $xx,xxx ( just follow don’t want to give up price).That’s $1435 difference, add in the “doc” fee which is car price to me 400 and we are a big $1835 off. That’s not bad. If I “ needed” a 2022 Subaru ascent, then I would have bought it already at this price.

My point is it’s not that dire. If you look at it as ok a dealer wants to sell a car he doesn’t have to sell at msrp or above- well yes they are “used car salesmen”. Like hearing about these crazy $5000 over msrp. Also remember it’s our tax dollars given to them that allow this egregious behavior.

DONT READ THIS PART:
so I’m looking and it’s not that bad. In fact,I started thinking about this when I recently received one of those dealer mailers stating that they want my car At the guaranteed trade in price. Yes, at Subaru prices it came out to give them 20k, my 2019 touring and get a 2021 touring- a one year old car. That’s when I realized that they were paying the “old” prices, not market prices. Just reselling my, car the dealer will net $4k to $5k. Doing nothing to it - I brought it to them. I’m not crying for any car dealers, just trying to do the best I can which is what everyone wants to do, but they are too afraid to try. There is no chip shortage! No logistics shortage! Look at the Amazon articles. They bought planes, cargo ships, and containers. The companies want to create the appearance of a shortage while they pocket your tax dollars and get the government to pay for their “ problem”. The government is giving $20 BILLION to the chip industry to build plants here. So the real story might be they got so much cash from the government that they can tell their customers to go you know where unless you buy the bs and pay the new “tax”windfall to them!

If you have other car(s) at your disposal and doing without your Ascent would not be an undue hardship, I say sell it now to the highest bidder...Carmax, Carvana, Edmonds, Varoom, etc, etc. At this hour it is worth more than it will ever be. Whether the "chip shortage" is real of manufactured, it is indeed a reality when is comes to both your car's worth, and what new car deals are to be had.

When the current market stabilizes and we are back to "normal", you will have cash in hand to strike the best deal possible at that time. I applaud your research and diligence, best of luck on whatever way you go.

 

[cindyascent]

Thank you, i’ ve thought of that - getting the money now and shopping later, but yet he other car is old and not really worth putting money into even though we do our own workif something major needs replacement. It’s ok now, but if it needed say the catalytic converters, then the legit ones will cost as much as the cars value. looked into assuming a short term of a lease. But found that those sites only have real deals that are taken by the time I see them, and then a bunch of ads.
I agree about the cash in hand and have been looking to get it in hand, but we also fish near the entry exit point for container ships in ny/nj and they are packed coming in and packed going out. So I’m shopping now, but I post to get feedback and info and really value the wealth of information that the site provides And am great full for the respouses and the discourse.

 

[Titanrx8]

The Subaru dealer offered a $12K trade-in, Carvana offered $19K cash.

I understand that the Subaru dealer is not a philanthropic organization, but neither is Carvana

What you're seeing is differences in business models and markets. The Carvana customer is convenience and app oriented and less likely to do as much due diligence as someone who walks into the Subaru dealership. Carvana will also ship cars to wherever they have the strongest market, the Subaru dealer is more likely to keep good Subarus to sell on their own lot and depends on the local market conditions. I haven't taken a car to Carvana but I suspect that their offer will be lower once they get you onsite and they inspect your car. They also make their money when they buy at the right price.

 

[cindyascent]

im pretty sure the price would go down At caravana. When I tried to sell our last car privately, all I had was people looking to talk down the price and flip it. I was shocked that real private buyers rather go to a lot and get the same car for a few more thousand dollars believing “ certified” or some other lingo means something Or that someone really reconditioned it.
it’s funny my neighbor deals cars from his house. He goes to auctions under someone’s whatever, buys totaled cars and sells them with rebuilt licenses in NY. all good until the weld does not hold and the car crash kills you. He is an immigrant and seems to sell to another type of immigrant, and it’s a little hard to see happen. Plus I don’t think he has to pay any capital gains tax until he gets caught.
he had a car that gave him trouble, after his son installed a spark plug - we only checked one and couldn’t take it out, for the last time- yup cross threaded the whole way- we explained that he had a car with an engine defect that needs a new engine, but was out of warranty. His answer- ”I sell it”. I can’t see how you can do that to people but hey he’s an” used car salesman”. They couldn’t understand one time a while ago- he brings them to like parking lots now so people don see where he lives- someone smashed a window on their car. Wonder why? But if you look at craigs list say in Staten Island NY - that’s the whole used car market now. Pictures of cars in say cvs parking lots. NY allows you to sell 5 cars a year or you have to be a dealer, which means a lot with spaces for 5 cars and a license. It’s a shame for the buyers.

 

[Packard8]

What you're seeing is differences in business models and markets. The Carvana customer is convenience and app oriented and less likely to do as much due diligence as someone who walks into the Subaru dealership. Carvana will also ship cars to wherever they have the strongest market, the Subaru dealer is more likely to keep good Subarus to sell on their own lot and depends on the local market conditions. I haven't taken a car to Carvana but I suspect that their offer will be lower once they get you onsite and they inspect your car. They also make their money when they buy at the right price.

I have no experience with Carvana & the like, but from the reviews I've seen they seem to keep pretty close to their offer estimates, providing the online condition the seller states is accurate. I recently sold my Ram/Cummins truck on FB Marketplace and got a bit more than what Carvana offered.

Good point on their ability to buy cars in lower value markets and ship and sell them where there is higher demand and value. I was surprised at the difference in offers.....$5K is not insignificant.

 

[Fletch123]

2022 ascent onyx, did a factory build online and added a few extras. Ended up negotiating 4% below MSRP of the factory build. In Washington DC area though and I was haggling with several different dealers. Due to be delivered next week, haven’t negotiated extended warranty cost yet.

 

[Scoobydoo]

I personally have never sold to Carvana or Zoom but know people who have. They all got exactly what was initially quoted, but they were very accurate with the information provided.

I did sell to Carmax (their offer was $3-4K higher than Carvana, Zoom, and trade-in offers, IIRC). That was a very simple process.

 

[cindyascent]

Grand Subaru said they sell $2000 over msrp go make it your self and give us your money. So I guess they don’t want to sell to me. Got no where in four days.
waste of time that that played it like that.

 

[cindyascent]

Can someone explain what a factory build is and after you do this factory build what do you do to get a price and purchase the car - sounds like build a bear

 

[Packard8]

Can someone explain what a factory build is and after you do this factory build what do you do to get a price and purchase the car - sounds like build a bear

Sit down with your dealer and go thru the options, pick & choose "A La Cart". Put down the deposit, and patiently wait! You will know the price when you place the deposit.

 

[rlb81]

Sit down with your dealer and go thru the options, pick & choose "A La Cart". Put down the deposit, and patiently wait! You will know the price when you place the deposit.

I recommend selecting everything online then sending it to several dealers for quotes. Let them know that you want to order, not get something off the lot.

If you walk in without an idea of what you want and the price then you have much less leverage on price. I wont step foot into a dealer without knowing the OTD price on a car I want, new or used.

 

[Jim_in_PA]

Can someone explain what a factory build is and after you do this factory build what do you do to get a price and purchase the car - sounds like build a bear

All it means is you order what you want. Build it on the Subaru website using "Build and Price" and then take that configuration to whatever dealers you want to get pricing from. When you buy that way you get exactly what you want and don't get anything you don't want. Your order gets placed by the dealer you select based on pricing and when it's been built, it's shipped to your dealer for delivery to you. In the best of times, that's about 8 weeks. It's a little longer right now due to supply chain.

Please note that you must pick your trim and colors as well as any applicable option package you want. That's what's built at the factory. Everything else comes from an extensive list of accessories that can be on the factory order (and are installed at the "port" (which for most folks is right outside the factory door, but at a site in New England for folks served by the distributors that Robert mentioned to you in another post) or at the dealer. "Port" installed can be less expensive because it doesn't hit you with installation labor like a dealer install will. You can generally get the same pricing consideration for accessories ordered with a factory order...that doesn't always happen when you buy them from the dealer separately.

 

[Packard8]

All it means is you order what you want. Build it on the Subaru website using "Build and Price" and then take that configuration to whatever dealers you want to get pricing from. When you buy that way you get exactly what you want and don't get anything you don't want. Your order gets placed by the dealer you select based on pricing and when it's been built, it's shipped to your dealer for delivery to you. In the best of times, that's about 8 weeks. It's a little longer right now due to supply chain.

Please note that you must pick your trim and colors as well as any applicable option package you want. That's what's built at the factory. Everything else comes from an extensive list of accessories that can be on the factory order (and are installed at the "port" (which for most folks is right outside the factory door, but at a site in New England for folks served by the distributors that Robert mentioned to you in another post) or at the dealer. "Port" installed can be less expensive because it doesn't hit you with installation labor like a dealer install will. You can generally get the same pricing consideration for accessories ordered with a factory order...that doesn't always happen when you buy them from the dealer separately.

Lol Jim, I should drag myself into the 21St century. The last time I spec'd out a vehicle was before the "Amazing Advent of the Interwebs". "Build and Price" is a great feature; email the build to all the dealers in your market and let them compete for your order.

 

[cindyascent]

Ok and if you don’t like the pricing you jus forget the whole thing?

 

[Packard8]

Ok and if you don’t like the pricing you jus forget the whole thing?

Really not much different than shopping on the new car lot. You build the car online, take the build sheet to several dealers and see who will place the order at the best price. Remember, the dealer has no financial investment at this point (other than their time) and in theory, should be willing to push the paper and handle the delivery for less than what they need to earn for cars in their physical inventory.

 

[Scoobydoo]

Ok and if you don’t like the pricing you jus forget the whole thing?

The only thing I will add related to ordering a vehicle is that if you're trying to leverage any incentives/special APR, a lot times those require you take delivery by a specified date so you could miss out on those depending on how long your delivery takes.

 

[G8k48OTP]

Placed a factory order for a 22 Limited in late October and picked it up from the dealer over the weekend. Used ASPCA VIP for invoice less 2%. No bogus fees or add ons and was also able to use my $500 loyalty certificate (my third Subaru). The price I paid was the out the door price I was quoted in October. Overall fantastic experience. I'm in SoCal.