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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey all, so, I reached out to SoA again, and they say they most definitely fully intend for 0W-20 to be used in the Ascent, except for occasions where it's not available to top off low oil, in which case 5W-30 can be used and swapped out at the next oil change.

To SoA:
(Hi, SoA) We're hearing all of the following, and I am hoping you can definitively clarify this so I can share it in the Subaru Ascent groups I help run:

We are hearing all sorts of things, including:
  • Not using 0W-20 (eg: using 5W-30) will cause the denial of various engine related warranty claims.
  • Not using 5W-30 will cause engine oil consumption and degraded engine parts.
  • All Subaru turbos MUST run 5W-30, regardless of what the manual says.
  • Subaru really wants 5W-30 in the car, but only put 0W-20 in it for emissions purposes.
From SoA:
Subaru of America Inc. understands there is a lot of information that is online regarding peoples opinions and or experiences.

We recommend reviewing the information provided in the Owner's manual on page 483 regarding the types of oil that are to be used in the 2019 Ascent.

5W-30 can be used if 0W-20 synthetic is not available on a temporary basis and should be switched back to 0W-20 at the next oil change. There are several characteristics that can cause a failure to not be covered under warranty and they are addressed on a case by case basis.

Should you require any additional assistance, please feel free to contact us at 800-782-2783.
No matter how many times I ask them, no matter how many ways, no matter through which point of contact, the answer is the same - "we meant it, use 0W-20 unless you absolutely don't have it and need to add oil, in which case use 5W-30 temporarily" and the implication that "it's possible" that some types of failure may be deemed related and thus cause uncovered warranty claims, but that will be determined on a case by case basis.

So, do what you wish... but be aware that four times so far, via multiple channels, I've gotten responses indicating the above in one form or another.
 

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But my Uncle Billy has runned straight 40 in his 87 Mustang GEE TEE and says I should run 20W-30!
 

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So, do what you wish... but be aware that four times so far, via multiple channels, I've gotten responses indicating the above in one form or another.
When I'm doing my delivery, and I go through the owners manuals and books, I make it pretty simple. (Note the following opening line only applies to Maintain the Love stores.)

You get four free oil changes with us, every 6 months or 6,000 miles, whichever comes first. After that first 2 years or 24,000 miles, if you want to go somewhere else, let me write this here and tell you. Your car is designed to use 0W-20 full synthetic oil. This is not an option, this is a requirement. This engine does not have the huge tolerances and gaps to use conventional weight motor oil like you'd put in your lawnmower. So please don't do it.
 

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When I'm doing my delivery, and I go through the owners manuals and books, I make it pretty simple. (Note the following opening line only applies to Maintain the Love stores.)

You get four free oil changes with us, every 6 months or 6,000 miles, whichever comes first. After that first 2 years or 24,000 miles, if you want to go somewhere else, let me write this here and tell you. Your car is designed to use 0W-20 full synthetic oil. This is not an option, this is a requirement. This engine does not have the huge tolerances and gaps to use conventional weight motor oil like you'd put in your lawnmower. So please don't do it.
I don't even know why it's for debate. It's in the owner's manual from SOA. if it says 0W-20 that's what you put. Simple.

Well said.
 

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I've found that Olive Oil does great! It's cheaper and makes a great smell too while you're driving. Feels like Italy!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
My favorite part of their response was where they said "its nice that people have opinions, but we put it in the manual because we really meant it" ?

At least that's how I read it.
 

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0W-20 has a better oil base than most 5w-30s anyways from what i understand and you could probably get away with running 0w-16 or 0w-8 as they do in Japan more than other countries and same could be said for 5w-30....the only problem i see with running 5w-30 is more wear at cold starts when temps drops and more load on engine which could cause to run hotter and get less MPG. I don't think running 5w-30 syn would cause any major issues within 100k, but why take the chance and the main advantage of lighter weight oils seems to be MPG and cold weather starts??

I don't think it will be long before we see 0w-8 come filled from the factory in compact cars and maybe even the Ascent to get those MPG numbers to creep up.
 

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I run what is in the manual. The biggest concern will be for those that go to Jiffy Lube or other quick lube places. They throw in whatever hose is close to the car. I know in my wife's Mazda 6 my brother in law warned my wife and her car had a lot of issues by the time we hit 100,000 miles and I think part of that might have been do to oil. Follow the manual!
 

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Yeah, I've been wary of Jiffy Lube for a bit. Honestly with where the oil filter is, and installing the drain valve; it's ridiculously easy to do your own. I may consider that as an option if I decide to do my own.
If I do have someone else do it; I will be for sure going to a much closer dealer to my house than the 60 miles to the other one I drove to to buy it
 

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I run what is in the manual. The biggest concern will be for those that go to Jiffy Lube or other quick lube places. They throw in whatever hose is close to the car. I know in my wife's Mazda 6 my brother in law warned my wife and her car had a lot of issues by the time we hit 100,000 miles and I think part of that might have been do to oil. Follow the manual!
Always good advise to follow the manual especially for Turbo engines, but who says what they put in the manual is what is "best" for the engine in the long run? Could it not also be best for them and their bottom dollar??? I have no idea, but i also know that other people and companies need to also lookout for themselves.


"But what's behind so many makers of ordinary cars requiring expensive synthetic oil in the first place? Linden says automakers can save between 0.5 and 1 percent on EPA fuel economy tests compared with 5W-20 motor oil. The tests are run starting with a cold engine, so the lower viscosity reduces friction until the engine warms up.

Indeed, when Honda first presented us with details about the 2012 CR-V, company engineers emphasized that they had gained 2 mpg in EPA fuel economy ratings mainly by reducing friction in the engine and other mechanical components, not by introducing new technologies like direct fuel injection or continuously variable transmissions.

We generally support any technology that can improve fuel economy. But in this case, we wonder whether some consumers who purchase new cars may feel blindsided by the increased cost of their oil changes. And since 0W-20 mainly only improves fuel economy for the first few seconds of driving, we question whether the fuel economy gains are really worth the added costs for consumers over the life of the car.

Regardless, it is quite possible that your next new car will require ultra-thin, synthetic 0W-20 motor oil. That is, until new standards come along. Linden says SAE is already working on standards for 0W-16 and 0W-12 blends, as well as what to even call thinner oils. No word yet on how much those will cost the consumer"

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro...s-expensive-oil-to-inexpensive-cars/index.htm
 

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And just to
, here is what Subaru Corp in Japan says about what oil is best. This is from another Subaru forum, where the debate rages on between what is best for your car, and what is spec'd in the manual.


********************************************************************

For those interested in the Subaru Japan comparison of 0w-30 vs 0w-20, I have translated this page for everyone:

0w-30:
High oil temperature engine protection - 4/5
Fuel economy - 4/5
Dirt resistance inside the engine - 5/5
Low temperature starting performance - 4/5
Exhaust gas performance (emissions) - 3/5
Usage feeling (smooth feeling) - 5/5

0w-20 "eco"
High oil temperature engine protection - 2/5 (yikes!)
Fuel economy - 5/5
Dirt resistance inside the engine - 3/5
Low temperature starting performance - 5/5
Exhaust gas performance (emissions) - 4/5
Usage feeling (smooth feeling) - 3/5


0w-20 "standard"
High oil temperature engine protection - 2/5 (yikes!)
Fuel economy - 4/5
Dirt resistance inside the engine - 4/5
Low temperature starting performance - 4/5
Exhaust gas performance (emissions) - 5/5
Usage feeling (smooth feeling) - 3/5
 

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I just bought the oil pump for taking the oil out from the top without even doing the valve at the bottom. That plus the filter on top should mean a 5 min oil change with little/no mess! I've always done my own changes but now it'll be even easier. Also means I can do it more often if I feel like it!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Are you sure? They actually recommend the 0w-20 for FA motors.

Because it is smooth oil from low temperature to high temperature, the engine runs lightly at any time.
The shear viscosity at 100 ° C, which is the normal oil temperature range, is kept low, the viscous drag which interferes with fuel saving performance is small, and it leads directly to fuel saving.
 

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When the debate finally settles down, in 10 years we'll have to find this thread when we're all jabbering about 0w16 or 0w8.
 

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Always good advise to follow the manual especially for Turbo engines, but who says what they put in the manual is what is "best" for the engine in the long run? Could it not also be best for them and their bottom dollar??? I have no idea, but i also know that other people and companies need to also lookout for themselves.
...
I look at it in two ways primarily, and then all the other preference, personal experience and conspiratorially stuff afterwards:
1. They designed it and did all their life testing with what they recommend (there is so much testing done on vehicles to simulate/verify the 10+ years and 100,000+ miles, it is rough to say the least).
2. They warranty what they built and recommend putting in it. They offer extended service plans (warranties) up to at least 120k miles as well.
 

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I look at it in two ways primarily, and then all the other preference, personal experience and conspiratorially stuff afterwards:
1. They designed it and did all their life testing with what they recommend (there is so much testing done on vehicles to simulate/verify the 10+ years and 100,000+ miles, it is rough to say the least).
2. They warranty what they built and recommend putting in it. They offer extended service plans (warranties) up to at least 120k miles as well.
There are also instances were 5w-30 is ok to run in the same engine in different countries and i think Forester is one of them. Some of these other countries don't have easy access to 0w-20 and i think that the primary reason behind it, but they also other similar warranties. So i'm not so sure 0w-20 is going to make it last longer and could have the opposite effect in say instances where you live in hot climates and tow a lot. I would also like to know how many times quick lube places have filled with 5w-30 instead of 0w-20 to save some cash and these cars will most likely be fine.
 

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Once an engine is up a running, the bearings don't care what the oil viscosity is. Because it's a rotating part, water would work (some propeller shaft bearings on boats use water). However, other engine parts that don't rotate do care very much - as do bearings when first starting up.


No, 5W-30 isn't going to damage your engine. 0W-20 was chosen to get better MPG, not because engineers prefer it. 5W-30 isn't going to screw up the variable cam timing or get hung up in those tiny engine passages.


Subaru correctly figures that most people don't keep their cars long enough to see any difference in engine wear.
 

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Guys, turbos are different.

..and not all synthetic 0W20 oils are the same.

I’m sure thats why they are saying 5w30 when 0w20 is not available.

When I ran Mobil 1 0w20 through an oil test, it was thin compared to others. (Viscosity on the low end of the 0w20 spec, whereas Redline 0w20 was on the heavier side of the specification.

Funny enough, Mobil 1 5w30 is on the low end of the specification for 5w30 oil, which makes it pretty darned nice for use in a 0W20 automobile. (Synthetic oils being different from more conventional oils with how the long chain molcules wind and unwind to act like 0W or 30W.)
 
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