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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here's the link:

https://www.foxnews.com/auto/400000-subarus-recalled-for-engine-issues

This is not click-bait, there's a recent thread in this forum where at least 2 people had that PCV valve replaced, one of them destroyed the engine due to a loose spring that fell into the engine. Seems to me this is exactly what they describe in this recall for the Imprezas and Crosstrek, isn't it?
 

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Perhaps or perhaps not... but, at least (1) they stepped up quickly, including publicly stating they're replacing any damaged engines or any engines where they cannot remove a complete PCV valve or all its parts and (2) it should be pretty easy to determine when people bring their cars in for regular maintenance.

I suspect dealerships will start checking to be on the safe side, and affected models will have PCV valves replaced before it happens.

I am not sure if we use the same PCV valve, or have it made by the same manufacturer.
 

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My 2018 Crosstrek is on the recall list and just traded it in the other day for my 2020 Ascent. No issues with the Crosstrek in 22,500 miles. It was perfect. Subaru did extend the full warranty on the CVT trans in the Crosstrek's to 10 years/100k miles. Since my 2020 Ascent was just built maybe they addressed the problem already with my build delay. Not worried because Subaru will always have us covered. By the way my 2020 Ascent is awesome and loving it.
 

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Saw this on google news,disturbing to say the least but atleast it’s made public and recalls will be in the mail soon.
 

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Worst part of recalls is the availability of loaner cars. Thankfully I have a 2nd vehicle already so it’s not a huge issue; also thankfully I haven’t had to go to the service department recently. There was a couple visits earlier this year where I wasn’t offered a loaner because everyone getting their brakes switches replaced had them.
 

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I don't get loaners from my dealer. They just shuttle us off to get some janky Enterprise rent-a-car, where you have to deal with their agents (i.e. salesmen). I wish I could get a Subaru when mine is in the shop. I'd even love to have a loaner Crosstrek some time. It might even make want to buy one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Perhaps or perhaps not... but, at least (1) they stepped up quickly, including publicly stating they're replacing any damaged engines or any engines where they cannot remove a complete PCV valve or all its parts and (2) it should be pretty easy to determine when people bring their cars in for regular maintenance.

I suspect dealerships will start checking to be on the safe side, and affected models will have PCV valves replaced before it happens.

I am not sure if we use the same PCV valve, or have it made by the same manufacturer.
Sure, I don't question Subaru's good will. How quickly they stepped up is relative: they are recalling 2017s, 2018 and 2019, so pretty much the problem went undetected for 3 years, this wasn't an isolated problem with one batch. Quick was the B pillar welds, which they caught in 3 days, this one I wouldn't call quick.
Given the huge number of vehicles recalled, there's a significant cost to do the recall. Replacement isn't complicated, but 200k vehicles the cost sure will add up. On the other side, replacing the complete engine of very few cars would be a lower cost, so to justify such a large recall, I think the expected number of engine replacements must be quite high.
But it would be dumb to replace them with the same valve, there must be a new revised version that doesn't break. This means they detected the problem, reengineered the valve and now that they have a part in production that doesn't fail they can do the recall.
Given that on a much smaller sample we saw 2 failures with valves falling the way it's described in the recall, it's probably a matter of time for them to recall the Ascents as well. They may not be at that stage of the process yet.
 

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I don't get loaners from my dealer. They just shuttle us off to get some janky Enterprise rent-a-car, where you have to deal with their agents (i.e. salesmen). I wish I could get a Subaru when mine is in the shop. I'd even love to have a loaner Crosstrek some time. It might even make want to buy one.
I have loaner Crosstrek from my dealer for one day. It was top of the line. Sound is nice but engine is not there. One day was enough to realize that I don't want it.
 

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The relative labor & parts costs of preemptively replacing all PCV valves or waiting to replace the very few engines that fail is one consideration, but an engine failing while driving can lead to accidents and very large liability exposure so I presume Subaru prefers doing the former rather than the latter.

AFAIK, it's the normally aspirated 2 liter engines that have the electrical and PCV valve issues. IDK if the same parts are used in the Ascent engine.
 

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I don't get loaners from my dealer. They just shuttle us off to get some janky Enterprise rent-a-car, where you have to deal with their agents (i.e. salesmen). I wish I could get a Subaru when mine is in the shop. I'd even love to have a loaner Crosstrek some time. It might even make want to buy one.
I wish my dealer would deal with a 3rd party! Mine...well the one I've used but doubt I'll ever go back to... uses Subarus as loaners. I've had a Forester and Outback but never a Crosstrek. Driving those vehicles made me appreciate the Ascent more.
 

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I found this from https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2019/RMISC-19V744-0683.pdf through a link from a CNN article (https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/24/us/subaru-recall-trnd/index.html).

Chronology of Defect / Noncompliance Determination
Provide the chronology of events leading up to the defect decision or test data for the noncompliance:

July 25, 2017 – Subaru received the first technical report from the U.S. market alleging that the owner
experienced engine vibration and a visible change in the amount of tailpipe exhaust while driving. Parts
were collected and it was observed that the PCV valve was separated. The PCV valve was replaced and
the issue was resolved. Since this was the first case, and the symptoms did not appear to indicate a
change in risk to relative safety, Subaru continued to monitor the field for additional data.

August 12, 2017 – January 24, 2018 - Subaru received a second technical report from the U.S market and
the supplier conducted an investigation of the collected parts. From the results of that investigation, it
was estimated that a loose washer moving inside the caulking could cause scraping in the aluminum
valve case potentially resulting in PCV valve separation. The cause of the loose washer was estimated to
be an improperly assigned press force value for the PCV valve. To expedite a preventative measure,
Subaru decided to change the material used for the PCV valve case from aluminum to steel, which began
on the engine production line on January 24, 2018.

February 22 – July 23, 2019 – Subaru received the first technical report related to this condition from a
foreign market alleging that the vehicle experienced a loss of motive power. Subaru received two
additional reports alleging loss of motive power; one on March 11, 2019 and the other on July 23, 2019.

October 10, 2019 –Subaru has received ten technical reports related to PCV valve separation from the
U.S. market, none of which allege a loss of motive power. Out of an abundance of caution, Subaru
decided to conduct a voluntary safety recall.
 

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Sure, I don't question Subaru's good will. How quickly they stepped up is relative: they are recalling 2017s, 2018 and 2019, so pretty much the problem went undetected for 3 years, this wasn't an isolated problem with one batch. Quick was the B pillar welds, which they caught in 3 days, this one I wouldn't call quick.
They stepped up ridiculously quickly. Sorry, I couldn't easily copy and paste the report, but @RainDog did above.

Also consider it's ten reports for 400,000 cars, and they are taking action.
 

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To expedite a preventative measure, Subaru decided to change the material used for the PCV valve case from aluminum to steel, which began on the engine production line on January 24, 2018.
I know- party foul to quote yourself, but since I'm really just quoting the NHTSA doc...

Does this mean that Subaru switched to the steel valve case for all vehicles in Jan 2018, and hence the Ascent? (Perhaps I could look, if only I knew where.)
 

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I know- party foul to quote yourself, but since I'm really just quoting the NHTSA doc...

Does this mean that Subaru switched to the steel valve case for all vehicles in Jan 2018, and hence the Ascent? (Perhaps I could look, if only I knew where.)
We don't use the same one. So, I am not sure if any of this is applicable to us.

1941

1942
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
They stepped up ridiculously quickly. Sorry, I couldn't easily copy and paste the report, but @RainDog did above.

Also consider it's ten reports for 400,000 cars, and they are taking action.
All this mess for only 10 reports? That I have to give kudos to Subaru, I would've thought there were a few thousand vehicles with the problem at least, to justify recalling 200k vehicles (the 400k number I think was for something else).
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
One thing doesn't add up: if the new part with steel case went into production in January 2018, why are they recalling 2017,18 and 19 vehicles? 2018 and 2019 would've come out with the new valve already.
 

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One thing doesn't add up: if the new part with steel case went into production in January 2018, why are they recalling 2017,18 and 19 vehicles? 2018 and 2019 would've come out with the new valve already.
Recall the old one. Recall the new design that showed a few of those ten issues.

And I suspect that they were mass built and shelved until needed.
 

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One thing doesn't add up: if the new part with steel case went into production in January 2018, why are they recalling 2017,18 and 19 vehicles? 2018 and 2019 would've come out with the new valve already.
A good question.
For what it's worth, the engine control recall includes 2017-2019 Impreza and 2018-2019 Crosstrek. The recall for the PCV valve includes 2017-2019 Impreza and 2018 Crosstrek. It does not include the 2019 Crosstrek.

Quite a few of the 2018 models would have been built and sold prior to Jan 2018. Of course, this doesn't explain including the 2019 Impreza.

There is also the simple possibility that switching to the steel case didn't solve the problem. I'm no mechanic, but from the description, the suspected problem is an "improperly assigned press force value for the PCV valve." The change from Al to steel would mitigate the damage, but I don't see why that alone would correct the core problem.
 

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Before anyone criticizes Subaru for their recalls, keep in mind that many car companies will do everything they can to avoid recalls, including putting their customers at serious risk. Recalls are costly and create bad publicity.

I really don't mind when I receive or hear about a recall. I feel this is far better than having an unknown, potentially dangerous issue which a company tries to cover up. This happens all too often and many companies do not take action until people are injured or lives are lost and then they're forced by the NHTSA to fix the problem.

So please give credit to Subaru for being proactive and willing to take the consequences. They appear to place customer safety and satisfaction above corporate greed. That's rare these days.
 
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